Scarborough resident charged after firing gun during attempted car theft

[u/Hmfic_48]

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2026/08/19/scarborough-resident-charged-firing-gun-vehicle-theft-toronto-police/

[u/steeleclipse2]

"...a resident of the home fired a gun during the encounter. The suspects fled before officers arrived."

Soooooo, it worked, right? Fucking Canada.

[u/Remarkable_Vanilla34 → u/steeleclipse2]

I mean im a gun owner and I think we should have self defense laws but I think because our system discouraged the use of firearms for the purpose people are not taught how and when the use shoukd apply.

For example, a lot of people don't understand how most rounds will just go through siding and drywall like it isn't there. Ironically 223. 22lr or bird Is actually better in tests because it breaks up but when most people think self defense (or in this case property protection) they think 9mm or buck shot.

[u/splooges → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

Ironically 223. 22lr or bird Is actually better in tests because it breaks up but when most people think self defense (or in this case property protection) they think 9mm or buck shot.

Agreed, this is a huge myth that many people believe, even amongst gun enthusiasts. Obviously this depends on the specific bullet being used, but people automatically assume that 223/556 over-penetrates but the truth is that a higher velocity and a lighter bullet translates to over-expansion and less penetration vs a slower, bigger 9mm bullet.

Even hunters get this wrong - most automatically assume that more speed = more penetration when the opposite is generally true.

Its one of the reasons why virtually every SWAT/ERT team has replaced their SMGs with 223/556 SBRs.

[u/613mitch → u/splooges]

Run of the mill 5.56 will definitely over penetrate (multiple) standard modern build walls almost consistently across the board. Almost everything from 22lr up will as well - in order to avoid this you'd need to spend a lot of time testing loads, projectile weights and constructions and barrel length to get something both effective on the intended targets and relatively safe for the environment it's being used in - and even then, it may not cycle well.

[u/splooges → u/613mitch]

Yeah, dry wall doesnt stop anything. But I imagine if you shoot 223 Vmax varmint ammo you'll over-penetrate less, without compromising cycle/rifle function.

[u/violent-trashpanda → u/splooges]

Do what about a 308 ? 

[u/git_and_grains → u/violent-trashpanda]

[u/radkiller22 → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

#3 is the best for this. Allegedly

[u/Remarkable_Vanilla34 → u/radkiller22]

See i think this should be something people are taught. Not because I want people to get in gun fights, but if it happens i don't want my neighbor putting a 30-06 through my door. Like the number of people I know that think a shotgun is Halo and you don't need to aim is alarming.

We are supposed aquire firearms for self defense but its absurd to think people don't or at least consider the possibility of having to use one for that purpose. Its ingrained in out media lol, everyone has thought about this situation

[u/Remarkable_Vanilla34 → u/[deleted]]

In not arguing that what he did was smart or legal or necessary, my point is that because we don't include firearms training for these type of situations, or self defense at all people find themselves in these situations with little idea the dangers it imposes.

If an armed aggressive intruder breaks into your house and you legally have time to procure a firearm and load it, your still taking a huge gamble that your not posing a threat to your neighbors.

And yes its not a legal reason to get a license, purchase or own a firearm, but there is precedence where its been deem justified to use one on self defense. My point is people should know what that entails.

[u/Curious_Joe2020 → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

Again we're not talking about self-defence inside a dwelling. There was no "aggressive intruder breaks into your house". Sorry that's not what happened at all. It was trespassing and MAYBE attempted theft of a car on a driveway OUTSIDE the dwelling.

We're talking about a guy who thought he was Rambo chasing people outside his house on the driveway with a gun and shooting at them. They tried to steal his car so what. Would he do the same thing if two teenagers tried to steal his bike from the front lawn? Reasonable and proportionate? No. Definitely not self defence. If he hit them or anyone else it would be attempted murder or manslaughter with a firearm. Was it worth it?

[u/Remarkable_Vanilla34 → u/Curious_Joe2020]

Did you actually read my comment? I never argued that he did. Im arguing that using a firearm for self defense is legal under the right circumstances and that people should be educated on what that entails, when it applies and what is appropriate to avoid this scenario.

[u/git_and_grains → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

The 223 fragmentation point is correct but needs a caveat: it only works above ~2,700 fps. From a 16" barrel that holds to about 100-125 yards. From a 10.5" SBR it drops to maybe 50 yards. Below that threshold M193 acts like an ice pick — punches through drywall intact.

9mm is the opposite problem. Ran four pistols (3.4" to 4.9" barrel) through half-inch drywall at 3 yards — every single one: full penetration, under 50 fps difference between them, over 90% energy retained on the other side. Barrel length barely matters. Drywall doesn't exist for 9mm.

The real variable isn't caliber — it's bullet construction. JHP through drywall gets its cavity clogged with gypsum and behaves like FMJ anyway.

[u/Curious_Joe2020 → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

22LR is better but not for that reason. That guy missed and would have missed 100% of the shots with 9mm or higher. 22LR has virtually no recoil, is light, and can fire many more rounds on target in the same time frame. That's why special forces use it and air force pilots for self-defence.

Also it's not self defense or reasonable proportional force, he chased car thieves outside his house.

[u/mywaaaaife → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

Shooting a slug indoors is a great way to ensure that Debra next door gets a round to the dome in her sleep.

[u/Haunting-Pool708 → u/Remarkable_Vanilla34]

Apparently #4 buck is the way to go for home defence in suburbs according to some American channels I’ve watched