Weekly Politics Thread

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[u/Doctor_Dabmeister]

I think the Liberals are now just speedrunning trying to stop the growth of legal gun owners in Canada. We legal gun owners are also quite unfairly stigmatized by many Canadians, especially the ones living in cities like Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal, and also their surrounding suburbs (basically the people who have the most say in an election). Here are my thoughts on what should be done in order to help change our public perception. u/Kerfaf also posted some good points about winning over urban Canadians and not copying the strategies of 2A activists in the US so please give their comment a read too.

We as individuals should do our best to have good faith conversations about guns with trusted friends and family, especially the anti-guns ones. We should mainly focus on activities like target shooting and hunting. We can also correct any common misconceptions they bring up about firearms in Canada. Sometimes, it may be best to just offer to take your anti-gun friends/family to a range or Crown Land. Giving them 20 minutes to plink with a .22 rifle may do more to change their mind about guns than debating them for 2 hours. We must also have realistic expectations though, one range trip or discussion about guns will not completely change their mind but it will get them thinking that legal gun owners are not as bad as society would like them to believe.

When discussing guns with friends/family, I would avoid politics initially but if it does come up, we shouldn't resort to name calling when it comes to the Liberals or any anti-gun groups. If you have to bring up Trudeau, just call him Trudeau, if you have to bring up the Liberal Party, just say the Liberals. As a general rule, don't use any language US Republicans use to refer to their political opponents. Also on the topic of the US, we should distance ourselves as much as we can from the US gun rights movement, especially the Republican ones. Much of Canada is rightfully disgusted with the Republican party. Associating ourselves with them will only hurt us in the long run. US gun rights mainly focuses on guns as a self-defense tool, I don't think most Canadians are comfortable with that idea yet.

I think Canadians deserve better firearm advocacy groups. I've only had an RPAL for 3 years and live in Ontario so please correct me if I'm wrong on certain things. I think our current advocacy groups have spent too much time preaching to the choir and not enough with public outreach. Have they advertised any sort of public outreach or events before the May 2020 OIC? Even after the OIC, all I remember they did was organize a small protest and they organized the Range Day this past weekend but barely any ranges in my area was participating. Do y'all wonder what they're doing with your donations? Some of the groups could benefit from a change in senior leadership too...

Lastly I want to bring up the Conservative Party. Even as a left-wing Canadian who has voted NDP, I've accepted the fact that I may have to vote CPC if I don't want to see my guns confiscated or "bought back" for pennies. This sucks a lot for me personally since I literally only agree with the CPC on the topic of guns.

The CPC and their voters need to realize that they must become more socially progressive, even more than O'Toole, if they want a chance at forming government in the present day. The CPC may be more socially progressive than they were 15 years ago or compared to US Republicans (the bar is so low when is comes to the Republican party it might as well be on the ground) but I'd say thats not enough for most Canadians. Lets go with the example of abortion which has many Canadians worried due to whats happening in the US. Its not enough for CPC leaders to be pro-choice, they should at the very least prevent their MPs from tabling any bills which may restrict abortion. Anti-abortion groups almost never seem to endorse Liberal or NDP MPs. Being condemned by anti-abortion groups should be seen as a badge of honour.

Even if the CPC does win the next election, there is a high likelihood it will be a minority government. I can't see the Liberals and CPC working together so they would need to form alliances with parties even more left to get a chance at passing anything. I remember Singh saying that he absolutely will not work with Scheer if he won a minority government but didn't say the same about O'Toole.

[u/drain-angel → u/Doctor_Dabmeister]

Complete lack of electoral & general basis for this entire comment aside, it's funny how you can say that gun owners should give up on issues such as 2A/self-defense/codification and then on abortion, despite by your own admission of all major parties holding a pro-choice position, is something that is completely infallible and that the party should go as far as whipping MPs over bills that weren't going to pass anyways to gain your personal approval (and somehow construe that as political reality).

[u/Doctor_Dabmeister → u/drain-angel]

I'm not asking gun owners in Canada to give up on issues of self-defense. I've posted replies in this post and previous posts where I said that I support the use of guns for self defense.

In my last post, I'm suggesting that gun owners initially avoid discussing self-defense when talking with anti-gun people. We'll have a hard time convincing those people guns should be used for self-defense when they get scared by just the sight of a .22 rifle. To be honest, I didn't want to write an entire essay with my views on firearms in Canada after work on a Monday.

Correct me if I'm wrong but all the other major political parties in Canada already forbid their MPs from tabling bills that restrict abortion. No reason why the CPC can't do that.

I'm no political expert, I'm just a Canadian posting about changes I would like to see. I've had people tell me here before that I should become a single issue voter just so we can all keep our guns. If they're expecting left wing Canadians to sacrifice their beliefs and vote CPC, the CPC should be willing to sacrifice some of their beliefs as well

[u/callofbooty95 → u/Doctor_Dabmeister]

We'll have a hard time convincing those people guns should be used for self-defense when they get scared by just the sight of a .22 rifle.

They're not going to be convinced by words and stats regardless. You really don't get it, do you?

[u/Doctor_Dabmeister → u/callofbooty95]

The unfortunate reality is that those people control elections in Canada. Gun ownership for self-defense will be a pipe dream for us as long as urban/suburban Canadian are ignorant when it comes to guns. Have any arguments worked for you when convincing those people that guns should be used for self defense? I'm not asking that to be sarcastic, I want to know so I can try it for myself

[u/callofbooty95 → u/Doctor_Dabmeister]

You're making my point for me. Those people run the show. My point is that they're emotional, particularly about left-wing sacred cows with no substance. Trying to convince them is a waste of time. It's much better to simply model responsible gun ownership, buy as many as you can, and stop giving a shit about the opinions of histrionics and morons. Bonus points if you rub it in their faces.

Have any arguments worked for you when convincing those people that guns should be used for self defense?

Yes. I'm in academia in a field that's 99% far left Marxists and almost all women. I ask them if they're serious about protecting themselves from rapists and the increase in "stranger attacks" that the media is going on about. If they say yes, I ask them why the gov't restricts guns and other weapons such as bear spray for self-defense. Then slip in a comment about how Trudeau has groped women etc. If they say no, I ask them why they value the health and safety of pervs and criminals over themselves.

Thing is, what I say can be backed by stats, but that isn't the point. It's ultimately an emotional appeal, and that convinces people far more than stats and logic, especially when I have been told, verbatim, that both of those are racist and colonial.