American here with a few questions

[u/CapThePunch98]

I'm not trying to gloat or anything like that, just genuinely curious about Canadians and how they're feeling about guns, gun rights, and gun purchases. You guys were clearly given the shaft when it comes to guns.

Question 1: I see a lot of comments here passing up on $900 SKS's or Carmel's because they're a ripoff. Why not spend a little extra to get your hands on a semi-automatic rifle since the vast majority of them are banned? I feel like I would if I were in your shoes. 22's are just cope imo.

Question 2: how sacred are guns to the average user here?

Question 3: how is morale? Do you guys have hope for the future? If a conservative PM wins, do you think he'll unban a lot of shit?

[u/warlock_barack]

Why is the idea of gun rights dumb? You're taking a hostile view towards the politicization of gun culture, but your government fired first when it decided to politicize against law-biding gun owners and carry out the will of a select few in Quebec and Montreal.

If the government didn't politicize the issue, you wouldn't have ended up with the OIC bans or bill C-21, because the so-called "compromises" (i.e., capitulations) of the 1990s already dramatically increased vetting of gun owners, and 85% of current handgun crime is conducted with illegally possessed firearms. Efficacious policy would address circulating, unregistered crime guns and their prohibited possessors.

Clearly, your pragmatic gun culture, as you might frame it, has not protected your community from relentless political attacks. What you need is politicization, a firm line in the sand, to stop further erosion.

If anything, you could learn from us Americans. We have fought and fought, in every court and legislature in our land, to retain our rights and it's still a difficult, oftentimes uphill struggle. Ask yourself this: if you don't even have the gun crime problems of the United States, why is your government so eager to disarm you?

The truth of the matter is: the PAL framework, the magazine restrictions, and most every other restriction you had even before 2020 are bullshit. You've just been so whipped and so caned by your lecturing politicians that the idea of having the freedom your grandfathers had gives you the feeling of resentment, because in lieu of that you would only have sadness and regret.

[u/The_King_of_Canada → u/warlock_barack]

What are you american? Why the fuck are you here? Canadian gun subs are for Canadians not american trolls spewing idiotic american rhetoric.

You're taking a hostile view towards the politicization of gun culture

You guys are proof that more guns = more crime and violence. Are you trying to say that guns aren't political? EVERYTHING IS POLITICAL. Are you detached from reality?

because the so-called "compromises" (i.e., capitulations) of the 1990s already dramatically increased vetting of gun owners, and 85% of current handgun crime is conducted with illegally possessed firearms. Efficacious policy would address circulating, unregistered crime guns and their prohibited possessors.

Yea agreed. But it's not your place to say.

has not protected your community from relentless political attacks

What it has accomplished is a lower crime rate than you guys.

What you need is politicization, a firm line in the sand, to stop further erosion.

And we will do it without americans sticking their noses, their money, and their shit politics into it.

Ask yourself this: if you don't even have the gun crime problems of the United States, why is your government so eager to disarm you?

This is typical american rhetoric. They aren't trying to disarm us. They are trying to appease special interest groups with money.

If anything, you could learn from us Americans.

Fucking lol. Learn what? How to elect a sex offender? How to strip your peoples of every freedom in the books? A woman in Florida was arrested for terrorism for saying deny defend depose your next to her insurance company.

Flock surveillance cameras are scanning faces, cars, license plates, and identifying features of every vehicle and person in your country to track everybody's movement.

People say the UK is the knife crime capital of the world but american knife crime per capita is nearly double. Tack on top of that gun crime and your country has the WORST crime rates of any developed nation and even some developing nations.

You speak of freedom yet your country hasn't ranked top 10 in the international freedom index in my lifetime.

You've fought? You haven't fought shit. You're a keyboard warrior. The NRA won lawsuits and then immediately shit on your own gun owners regarding bumpstocks and suppressors in Trumps first term.

Fuck the 2nd amendment doesn't make any sense. Seriously why do you need the federal governments permission to overthrow the federal government? Isn't it's very existence redundant? Doesn't it set the bar so low that your politicians can get elected just by saying they protect gun rights? Then if you try to use those "rights" to rush the Capitol or shoot Trump those same politicians hide behind their armed security while they cut you down.

Can you americans grow up and realize that you don't actually have gun rights?

Still I would rather suffer our politics surrounding this hobby, this one aspect of my life, that I love than deal with the shitstorm that you guys have down south.

[u/warlock_barack → u/The_King_of_Canada]

Okay, bub. If you want to incorporate every reflexively negative thought you harbor towards America against my specific argument that your gun owners are mistreated by your government, then I will reciprocate in kind.

First, your country has weak constitutional protections in general, not just with respect to firearms. You do not have as robust of speech protections, and your Canadian Charter of Freedom is full of deferential language that allows the government to impinge on even supposedly guaranteed rights.

Second, you note the issue of mass surveillance in the United States by way of mentioning data collection by Flock cameras. We do have institutionalized (e.g., via PATRIOT Act) and private surveillance, but arguably surveillance is even worse in other parts of the Anglo-sphere, such as in the UK. While I have not studied the issue intensely, I am aware of the currently debated bill C-22 and the 2001 and 2015 Anti-Terrorism Act(s) passed in your country. So, your country does have a surveillance infrastructure and an interest in increasingly monitoring its citizens. Whether you respond to C-22 with the same outrage as Flock cameras located in another country remains to be seen.

Third, your economy is much less powerful or diversified compared to the United States. Your GDP per capita is lower while your housing prices are significantly higher, and your government hardly seems interested in stabilizing a housing market that has been outpacing wages for decades. While these trends are familiar to us, they are exacerbated somehow in Canada.

So, while I do not enjoy making tit-for-tat comparisons, especially because I still like Canada and was in Toronto as recently as 2024, I do think your moral superiority is unfounded.

Now, for clarification. You say I haven't fought for gun rights. Well, I have fought for my gun rights. I left my home state of Washington specifically because of its anti-gun turn in 2022/2023. I have written my legislature in the past, I have commented on the Federal Register (when ATF proposed changes to rules), and I have donated to pro-gun groups (SAF, FPC, etc). I doubt you can say you've fought for any right or idea that hard.

Finally, you frame the second amendment as a purely government-phobic right. Twice now, you have insisted, that it is silly to ask the government for a right that protects you from the government. The second amendment is a right that allows us to keep and bear arms for the purpose of lawful self defense and common defense against all enemies foreign or domestic. It is first about defense, though people own guns for all sorts of reasons familiar to Canadians (e.g., sporting, hunting, pest control, etc).

Where your hostility comes from I have no clue.

[u/The_King_of_Canada → u/warlock_barack]

You do not have as robust of speech protections

Yes we do. We've had numerous supreme court cases set down precedent to support our freedom of expression. You don't know what you're talking about.

C-22 is not law and is being heavily neutered because Canadians know what it will do. As you said your patriot act is already law and grants your government more powers than the original C-22 would. You don't know what you're talking about.

Third, your economy is much less powerful or diversified compared to the United States.

The economy argument is a shit argument. The US is the richest country in the world and has 10 times our population. We know. That means 2 things. 1. your vote matters less. 2. your politicians are all bought and paid for. You guys make judges and sheriffs campaign for office which shoves them right into the pocket of their campaign donors.

Guess what bud? Might doesn't make right anymore.

Our housing prices are the same when you factor in the dollar difference. Bud housing is a global issue at the moment or do you just not pay attention? You don't know what you're talking about.

I do think your moral superiority is unfounded

No. It really isn't. Not with the amount of bodies your country has at it's feet. You don't know what you're talking about.

All your 2nd amendment has done is arm the drug deals, gang bangers, biker gangs, and rapists. And armed the ones in the countries to the north and south of you. You nuts always say you need it to protect yourself from tyranny then put the boot directly on your neck when it also hurts people you don't like.

Where your hostility comes from I have no clue.

You cunts continuously invading our spaces threatening our lives and our country shitting on our culture and way of life. You clearly don't know what you're talking about.