Rim fire over all length question.

[u/casual_canuk]

When it comes to legal OAL for a rim fire fire arm is the muzzle attachment included? For example if i wanted to put a folding stock on my rifle that would bring it under legal length if I attached a fake suppressor and just never removed it would it still count towards the overall length even though it could be removed with out a tool?

[u/MasterScore8739]

I don’t remember where exactly I found the I’ve quoted previous, but no. A muzzle attachment does not count towards barrel length in Canada.

If I find someone better, I’ll update this.

the barrel length is the distance from the muzzle of the barrel to and including the chamber.

That’s from the Non-Resident Firearm Declaration Form. I’m trying to find just the generalized on for firearms remaining in Canada.

Edit:

Okay, found a better reference.

For firearms other than revolvers, the barrel length is the distance from the muzzle of the barrel to and including the chamber, but it does not include the length of any attachments. Refer to the diagram.

This is from the Application to Register Firearms and is current as of 2022. With how our laws are, I highly doubt it’s changed to allow an attachment to count towards barrel length.

[u/Hot_Cheesecake_905 → u/MasterScore8739]

the barrel length is the distance from the muzzle of the barrel to and including the chamber.

This only applies to centerfire rifles, rimfire does not have barrel length minimums.

Rimfires just need to be 660mm long minimum not to be classified as a restricted firearm.

Permanently attached muzzle devices should count towards overall length, which is the only metric that matters for a rimfire. It's really no different than a removable picatinny stock.

As for the folding stock, if your gun can fire while folded, it won't meet the minimum length definitions, so I avoided getting a folding stock for my 10/22. It's too bad there aren't more fixed picatinny stocks on the market though, lots of cheap folding ones.

[u/MasterScore8739 → u/Hot_Cheesecake_905]

You know what, you are absolutely right. I ended up going down a bit of a rabbit hole focusing on the barrel length.

I can’t find anywhere on either the RCMP website or firearms program where they mention any legal way of measuring the OAL.

In my mind though if an attachment to the barrel does not count towards its length for legal measurements, I can’t see how it would count towards the overall length of the firearm for a legal measurement either.

[u/Hot_Cheesecake_905 → u/MasterScore8739]

I can’t find anywhere on either the RCMP website or firearms program where they mention any legal way of measuring the OAL.

Yeah, there’s nothing defined for rimfires, so it’s up for interpretation.

As for permanently attaching muzzle devices, anyone know where to get Rocksett in Canada? Similarly Vibra-Tite VC-3? It seems like we have a shortage of these threadlockers.

[u/MasterScore8739 → u/Hot_Cheesecake_905]

Is there a defined way for centre fire when it comes to measuring overall length?

I can’t even find anything for them outside of needing an 18.6” barrel and above 26” OAL.

If rockset isn’t an option, I’m sure a pin and weld would be just as solid. 🤷🏽‍♂️

[u/chillyrabbit → u/MasterScore8739]

In the FRT processing table guide, there is a slight throwaway line that overall length is measured with all attachments.

https://dennisryoung.ca/2016/05/12/rcmp-release-firearms-reference-table-frt-processing-procedures/

dealing with barrel extensions/flash hiders, etc.:

• represent the true barrel length in child entries.

• in barrel length notes mention the availability of the extension/flash hider and what the overall length is when these parts are included.

• in Canadian Law Comments mention that the extension/flash hider, etc. is not recognized as part of the barrel length in the Criminal Code and therefore cannot be included in the barrel length.

Additionally there have been several cases of firearms having barrel attachments be considered for overall length.

The 2 examples that come to mind is

the GSG15SE, which had the wrong faux suppressor installed, and a longer one was allowed to be installed to remain NR.

The Troy PAR was noted by IRUNGUNS as possibly being R when they were importing the first batches, but had it reevaluated to be NR when including the flash hider.

[u/MasterScore8739 → u/chillyrabbit]

Welp, a letter from the RCMP stating that is proof enough for me I guess.

I’m going to have to keep this one in my back pocket.

[u/gspotcowboy → u/MasterScore8739]

I can’t see how it would count towards the overall length of the firearm for a legal measurement either.

Barrel length measurement is defined in the code/act. Rimfires are not subject to barrel length requirements and therefore OAL applies

[u/MasterScore8739 → u/gspotcowboy]

I’d just like to state that I’ve been made aware attachments to the barrel do count towards overall length.

However what my line of thought was is that is something like a pinned/welded muzzle device does not count towards the overall length of the barrel in a legal sense, then it wouldn’t count towards it for the firearms overall length either.

Since a barrel is designed for either a threat protector (does not increase length at all) or an attachment, they would measure at the shortest possible configuration.