Shotgun or rifle

[u/z00animal]

I have many 22lrs now. Trying to decide if I should get a short barrelled shotgun (less than 16 inch) or a 223/5.56 centre fire (308 is a consideration as well but ammo is pricey) and of course 16 inch or less. I have a thing for short barrels.

Use would be almost exclusively at the range. I don’t hunt but the thought of having it in the wilderness is intriguing.

Help me decide please. Would be a first for a shotgun. I’ve had centre fire rifle before but gave it to family and can’t get it back.

[u/Whispersfine]

I’m surprised and disappointed that you didn’t even think of Sks at all.

[u/burgers1919 → u/Whispersfine]

If this Reddit has taught me anything it is that in order to make your first post one should own an SKS

[u/Whispersfine → u/burgers1919]

Or at least seriously consider getting one.🤣

[u/z00animal → u/Whispersfine]

I forgot to add if it’s a rifle bolt action and if it’s a shotgun pump. The sks is with the family and they won’t give it back lol

[u/Holiday_Equivalent15 → u/z00animal]

I know you said .308 is pricey but I did purchase a Tikka T3x in .308 not long ago and it has been nothing but phenomenal. Super tight grouping up to 200+ yards (haven't been able to take it out further yet) with an action smoother than warm butter. It's *very* light as well, which is a nice consideration if you plan on taking it out hiking or hunting. I believe the T3x also has a .223 variant if you wanted to stick to the cheaper ammo. Can't speak to how good it is in that calibre but my own experience with my own rifle has made me a staunch believer in Tikkas. For a slightly higher budget, you'll have a rifle that I'm convinced will never let you down.

[u/z00animal → u/Holiday_Equivalent15]

I saw a video of a mythical t3x roughtech that was 16 inch’s. But no idea if tikka ever made one.

I held a .308 ruger scout gen 2 and kind of regret not buying it on the spot. It didn’t last long in the shelf.

[u/z00animal → u/z00animal]

Oh looking at shot shells. It’s not as cheap as I thought.

[u/Hot_Cheesecake_905 → u/z00animal]

What are you planning on using the shotgun for? Perhaps a Mossberg field and security combo for best flexibility. Semi-auto shotguns are also very fun too.

[u/z00animal → u/Hot_Cheesecake_905]

Just range fun. Obviously I wouldn’t be shooting it 100 meters.

I’ve been eyeing a Mossberg 590 shockwave.

[u/Whispersfine → u/z00animal]

All good. I’m just teasing you.

For range only I’ll probably look at the mossbergs. Maverick if you are short on the dough and 590 shockwave if you really want to go pro.

A bolt 223? I will choose a Howa on a tight budget. If you have a deep pocket, you’ll like tikka. Smooth like butter, accuracy is dead on. Ruger American Gen II is also nice but not as smooth at all.

[u/Water-Foul]

Ruger american in 556 is an awesome gun. You can put ten rounds in it too

[u/holdencaulfield1983]

Mossberg 590A1 12 gage with 14” barrel for a shotgun and CZ 600 Tail 223 with 16” barrel for a rifle.

[u/Iokua_CDN → u/holdencaulfield1983]

That's my thoughts.  Though for the price of a 590a1, you can actually buy a Mossberg Shockwave and a Maverick 88. Then you can combine parts to have a full stock 14 inch shotgun, while still having a longer barrel to swap on. Plus an extra receiver in case something ever breaks on the other one 

[u/Iokua_CDN]

I have a short barrel shotgun,  a wood stock canuck defender.  Let me run through the features

Its got both a full stock and the pistol grip. I've only ever used the full stock. 

It's fit screw in Chokes and longer barrels available. I have a screw In barrel extension that can bring it to a 20 inch barrel,  or I have a 28 inch barrel I can put on for hunting,  or I can do both and have a freaky long 34 inch shotgun (probably very quiet with a barrel that long)

In its 14 inch confirmation,  it's about the same length as my 16 inch lever action. Very compact and usable. It's still nice to shoot,  not unpleasant  at all,  so 14 is just a really good length. 

5 round in the tube. So plenty of capacity.

And it's lovely wood! I'm a bit of a Fudd so I love my guns too have some old school charm, while being a super useful  short barrel shotgun. 

Best of all, price is cheap.  I payed 300 for the gun,  150 for the extra barrel.  Prices may be different now but sales still come close.

But if you are wary of Turkish guns,  I understand,  then look for a mossberg Shockwave on sale and put a full stock on it.   Or better yet,  buy a mossberg Shockwave, and then buy a long barrel Maverick 88.  This will get you both the stock,  and a longer barrel for usually 300 bucks or less.  Plus you'll have that extra receiver to either use or save as a back up.  If my Canuck ever broke on me, I would likely do this myself.  Shockwave and a Maverick and then just swap pieces to get my perfect gun. 

Either way though, the shorty shotgun is likely way cheaper than a 223, and it also opens up a fun new world of shooting clays! I bought a 50 dollar clay thrower and I have a ton of fun out blasting clays.

So that's my suggestion, I'll comment a part 2 though on the short bolt action too

[u/Iokua_CDN → u/Iokua_CDN]

So,  I have a short barrel shotgun, but I also have a shorter bolt action centerfire! Like you, I also have a thing for short barrel guns. (I also have a really short 410 revolver shotgun but that's a story for another post!)

The rifle I have is a CZ Trail in 7.62 x39, not 223 (though they have 223 as well)

16 inch barrel and a collapsing stock make this  one of my most compact guns, even shorter than my shotgun.

The good about it? It's very accurate, it's very compact. The Rail is super long so I have a huge selection of scopes and optics I can use. I've used flip up irons sights, I've used traditional knotch and post sights, I've used a red dot, I've used an LPVO scope. But you could also throw on a scout scope or pistol scope, or prism or even a traditional hunting scope.  The options are endless.

The bad is that a 16 inch barrel makes a noticeable fireball and has more kick and concussion! Something I'm still getting used to, but it'd noticeably more kickback  than my Sks. Because of this I do suggest maybe getting a 223 or 7 62 x39 instead of a 308... I imagine a 16 inch 308 is even more of a blast!

But if you don't want a CZ trail, you also got other options!

Ruger american  makes both a 7 62 x39 and a 223. They have several different models, and all are reliable and fun to shoot.

Tikka has a 223 ranch rifle, and while it's a but too expensive for me, lots of folks love tikka.

Black Creek Labs makes very short bolt actions, like 16 or 12.5 inch barrels. I hear their quality control isn't very good,  but they have excellent warranty.

So you have a couple options. Personally I see it as go Ruger for the traditional stock,  CZ Trail for the compact stock, and Tikka if you want more quality.

[u/z00animal → u/Iokua_CDN]

Thanks for the reply. I hadn’t consider 7.62 x39. I read that 7.62x39 has dried up lately.

[u/Iokua_CDN → u/z00animal]

It's not what if once was, with Chinese Surplus mostly out of stock right now considering the ongoing wars.  But you also got a few more manufacturers now.

Barnaul is no longer imported though, so you kinda are stuck with norinco non corrosive as the 50c non corrosive round. 

But considering it's continued military use,  there will eventually be more Surplus,  and we might someday get more barnauls, or a Ukrainian company will export some when they don't need it as bad. 

Still plenty available though, just not the vast avalanche of it from the past

[u/Iokua_CDN → u/z00animal]

Wanted to add, winchestor xrp also does a 16 inch 223.

Also Londerno has a used remmington 783 in 223 for like 800 bucks.  Add in a Canuck Defender/regulator  for 400 and you could have both guns for 1200!

[u/z00animal → u/Iokua_CDN]

Winchester XPR wasn’t on my radar before. Thanks I’ll look into it.

[u/Lumindan]

What kind of distance are you looking at?

What's your budget?

[u/z00animal → u/Lumindan]

Distance is probably gonna be 100m max. Budget is 1200 before tax

[u/One_Salary_9068]

The shortest auto shotgun is 18.5... if you want 16 you have to go with a Pump or other actions.

[u/isanthrope_may]

.243 is a nice option. Loads for everything from gophers to deer, shoots flat out to 300m, lots of options available for fit/finish/budget.

[u/pyates1]

You can get spam cans of 7.62x51 for very reasonable prices and a decent accurate bolt action for $1000.

What are you going to do with a short barreled shotgun at the range? That will get old quick. Also, shotgun shells are expensive.

[u/z00animal → u/pyates1]

You got a point. At least with a rifle I can shoot short and far.

[u/pyates1 → u/z00animal]

There is also the advantage that a short barrel 308 loses very little in accuracy. A bolt is much more accurate than a semi as a rule.

The sks is still a solid/entertaining option in case nobody has mentioned it LOL

[u/IndividualCertain358]

308 would be needed in the wilderness. but 556 is cheap ammo. shotguns are between on ammo cost.

if you plan on having it in the wilderness, 100% 308. , but shotguns for sports shooting like IPSC are fun, plus all the 223/556 options suck right now.

[u/z00animal → u/IndividualCertain358]

I think I’ve at least narrowed my choice down to a bolt action. Shotgun would be nice for fun but a rifle would give me the option of shooting to longer distances.

[u/IndividualCertain358 → u/z00animal]

The issue with shooting distance, is that there are very few options to do that. Unless you join something like the Ontario rifle association. There are few ranges long enough.

[u/Remote_Mistake6291]

One hundred meters rules out a shotgun, even more so with a short barrel. There are quite a few bolt action .223's, but depending where you live .223 may not be legal for hunting. Go to a shop and shoulder a few and see what fits.

[u/swift_gilford → u/Remote_Mistake6291]

\*laughs in Vang Comp'd shotgun barrel***