Crusader Backland Hunter precision testing

[u/some_guy2024]

A friend of mine has a couple Crusader Arms Backland Hunter elites so I borrowed one to do some precision testing. I was quite curious to see how it would do seeing as I’ve done the same kinda testing on pretty much every model they’ve released (WS-MCR, Sentinel, Crypto) and was rather impressed by how tight the MCR shot (10rnds of 75gr handloads into 1.5 moa) despite how crude it was. The Sentinel was a bit of a dog with a wandering zero and the Crypto was a hammer (only the receiver was stock and it had a legit match barrel on it).

As far as I’m concerned, any .223/5.56 semi that will keep 10rnds of match ammo sub 2moa is a legit 600yd gun when equipped with a suitable optic (1-8/10, 2-10, etc).

So I mounted a Vortex Razor Gen 2 4.5-27, an MDT Send it and Grndpod and got to it.

I shot a 10rnd group of American Eagle 55gr 5.56, my 55gr Campro plinking load (26.5 BLC-2) and my go to match load (Hornady 75gr BTHP over 23.9gr N150) that shot 1/2moa in my bolt gun, 1 moa in a Crypto and used to shoot 1.5 moa in a Colt 6920.

The 55gr performance was terrible, the AE was approx 4.5 moa and my handloads were approx 6 moa. I dunno that I’ve ever shot a semi that grouped that loose, haha. So despite having zero expectations at this point the 75gr load was outstanding. 10rnds into 1.05 moa. I’m not sure how a rifle can fare so poorly with 55gr ammo and hammer with 75s but it is what it is 🤷🏼‍♂️. I then shot the 75gr ammo at some of my practice targets at 400, 420, 465 and 625 yds and made 1st round hits till the last target (wind was blowing pretty good, needed 2.0 mils of wind to hit)

As an aside I had zero malfs over about 65 rounds which is obviously a tiny sample size but it’s something. The trigger is pretty bad but I guess not much worse than a GI trigger. Unless I’m missing something the safety is kind of a pita. Easy to push off when shouldering the rifle but awkward to re-engage when lowering the rifle. I also can’t reach the mag release without breaking my grip. If you look at the primers on all the ammo you’ll note that they are visibly cratered despite being mild loads (the handloads, that is). I recall the same issue with a WS-MCR that was solved by getting the firing pin hole bushed. Food for thought, I guess.

[u/GodsGiftToWrenching]

Whats the twist? 1:8 or 1:7 probably eh? If so 69 grains projectiles would be probably ideal for a 1:8 twist and if it' 1:7 that explains why 55 grain loads are giant while 75 grain is minty. I will say I'm impressed that the 75 grain projectiles group just over an moa. How many of shots per group? Best group I can get out of a ruger american ranch gen 2 is 1.5 at 100 meters with 10 shot groups of 69 grain SMK's

[u/some_guy2024 → u/GodsGiftToWrenching]

There’s no indication of twist rate on the barrel. I’ve shot plenty of 55gr ammo in 1:7tw barrels across many platform and never seen it shoot so poorly but it is what it is. All groups were 10 rounds as I don’t really think 5rnd groups are very indicative of the average level of precision of a carbine (unless you composite a couple groups).

[u/GodsGiftToWrenching → u/some_guy2024]

Fair enough, I have heard of alleged results from a Bren 2 where 55 grain was massive and 75 grain reels in well because of the NATO 1:7 twist, but WK-180's were better with 55 grain and 6X grain projectiles, a 1:9 would be best for 55 grain, or whatever the Colt SP-1 has, that is a laser beam

Oh perfect, 10 rounds groups are proper, I hate when people do "accuracy" tests but only do 5 or 3 round groups

[u/some_guy2024 → u/GodsGiftToWrenching]

Yeah, I think you end up getting pretty big variations from barrel to barrel (regardless of twist rate). The WS-MCR I shot grouped 55s decent but hammered 75s, I shot some M855 and 75s through a WK but can’t recall how it grouped. Was good enough to consistently hit a 12” square at 400yds (cause that’s what it was used for as a stage gun at a match I was running).

I’m pretty sure the SP-1 had a 1:12tw like the original M16 & M16A1.

[u/gspotcowboy → u/some_guy2024]

My RAR lobs 55gr bulk. Like best I ever saw out of it was 3-4 MOA and I tried 5 different brands. I was concerned I got a lemon until I started using heavier stuff and have it sighted in for green tip which is a consistent 1.5ish.

69gr match ammo will cloverleaf but I can't afford that for range days lol

[u/some_guy2024 → u/gspotcowboy]

Handloading is the ticket. My 75gr reloads cost me the same or less than factory fodder.

[u/HappyCan7250 → u/gspotcowboy]

That's actually why I ended up selling my RAR gen 2. I don't want to be buying $2/rd match ammo just to get it shooting decent. Both my Savage 110 and MVP Patrol shoot about 1.5moa with cheap bulk 55gr, sometime better, sometimes worse, but the Ruger was shooting 4-5" groups with the same ammo.

Sold it and bought the 110 Hog Hunter instead. Very happy with the 110 for $750. There was a lot I liked about the ruger, I really wanted to love it, but any 55gr ammo shot like shit and I already had tons of that ammo, so it was easier to replace the rifle than restock on match 77gr 223

[u/South_Mycologist_471]

Fuck ya fellow PWA range member!

[u/PM_me_ur_TT-33]

What's the twist rate and freebore to lands? I saw an indication it was 1:8 and "wyld" but nothing concrete.

[u/some_guy2024 → u/PM_me_ur_TT-33]

My buddy told me it had a Wylde chamber which is pretty common (since it’s a good compromise for running .223 and 5.56) but there’s no indication of twist or chambering on the barrel. I didn’t bother measuring how far it was to the lands.

[u/Elbro_16 → u/some_guy2024]

If you reload chamber doesn’t even matter

[u/some_guy2024 → u/Elbro_16]

Chamber really only matters for running 5.56 which can get you over-pressure in a .223 chamber.

[u/Elbro_16 → u/some_guy2024]

I believe it only over pressures because bullet can jam into throat, but I’ve yet to see a modern 223 chamber that jammed on a 5.56 round.

[u/some_guy2024 → u/Elbro_16]

It’s not a matter of the bullet jamming into the lands since .223 and 5.56 gave the same OAL. I wanna say that the increased freebore in a 5.56 chamber vs a .223 chamber keeps the peak pressure lower.

[u/Elbro_16 → u/some_guy2024]

But I’ve heard 5.56 can have different o give? That’s why they say if bolt doesn’t close easy don’t fire it

[u/some_guy2024 → u/Elbro_16]

Naw, OAL is the same in .223 as in 5.56 because it’s all designed to fit in an AR mag. I’ve run 75s loaded way too long to fit in an AR mag in a bolt gun and never hit the lands. 5.56 and .223 brass are dimensionally the same and the bullets are seated at the same OAL, 5.56 is just loaded hotter and the chamber has more freebore.

[u/Dill_Pickle_Tears]

Wondering if they really did implement the needed fixes for the elites. Huge if true. Do you feel like these are at all worth the $$ given the state of the market?

[u/DougMacRay617 → u/Dill_Pickle_Tears]

No especially with the makasi becoming a contender this summer.

[u/Dill_Pickle_Tears → u/DougMacRay617]

I’d rather the Makasi as well considering the comparable price.

Though I’d love something akin to a fightlite SCR or Valmet hunter for a reasonable price that actually functions reliably. The BH checks all the boxes except the last one

[u/some_guy2024 → u/Dill_Pickle_Tears]

Hard to say. If the Makasi was available today then no way. At this point we don’t even know if the Makasi arrives before it gets banned. The Backlands might also get a prohib FRT tomorrow, who knows. If you don’t currently have a semi .223 that you’re comfortable shooting or really want one that is legal (for the time being) then if this sample is any example it’s the top of the heap (given the Alcor I previously tested had a wandering zero). If you’re in a financial situation where losing $2k is ok then I’d say go for it.

[u/BrotherLefthand → u/Dill_Pickle_Tears]

Not worth it if the Makasi survives the libs.

[u/DougMacRay617]

Do you crimp your 223 loadings? New to reloading and i dont worry about it for my 6.5 but ive heard everyone say you need to crimp 223/556

[u/Elbro_16 → u/DougMacRay617]

4 thousandths neck tension will be good for semi auto

[u/some_guy2024 → u/DougMacRay617]

I never have. I’ve run 10s of thousands of handloads (55, 62 & 75gr)through carbines over the years and never had an issue. I do crimp for 9mm and 7.62x39 though.

[u/DougMacRay617 → u/some_guy2024]

Interesting. What makes you crimp for x39?

[u/some_guy2024 → u/DougMacRay617]

I was trying to get a TNA AR mag adapter to work in an SKS and witnessed the rounds getting pounded into the action and the bullets getting pushed into the cases, haha. So when I decided to try reloading for an SKS and the dies I had could do a crimp I figured it might be a good idea 🤣

[u/DougMacRay617 → u/some_guy2024]

Ohh fair point. Thats the same reason i was told to crimp 223/556. The same person told me that it may not be as important for us because we dont get to utilize 30rnders so thr 5 rnds in the mag aren't getting banged around as much