r/canadaguns • u/eldaniay • Apr 01 '26
Misc Would a civilian SA80 be non-restricted in Canada?
I was looking at the SA80 from this link https://gunsweek.com/en/rifles/news/murdoch-co-em85-rifles-real-civilian-sa-80. it seems to me that this would be classified as non-restricted. I took a look on armalytics and it is only banned due to being automatic, but a semi auto clone should be fine.
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Apr 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/GinnAdvent Apr 01 '26
Aww man, I was waiting for VHS2 as well. Hope we will get rid of OIC eventually.
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u/SpectreBallistics Spectre Ballistics International (Verified) Apr 01 '26
It would be prohibited for several reasons.
1) Designed after C-21
2) AR-180 variant
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u/goshathegreat Apr 01 '26
Technically it was designed far before bill c21, and it’s as much of an AR180 variant as the Bren 2 or X95, which aren’t classified as AR180 variants.
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u/leyland1989 Apr 01 '26
Stop talking logic here. Natalie thinks it looks too scary, that's all it takes to be prohibited.
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u/eldaniay Apr 01 '26
its not developed after C-21. Its a variant of the sa80, which was developed before. Also you are trolling with it being an ar-180
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u/SpectreBallistics Spectre Ballistics International (Verified) Apr 01 '26
The L85 / SA80 are directly developed from the AR-18. The RCMP have declared firearms a variant with a lot less relation than these have.
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u/Automatic-Height4246 Apr 01 '26
If its original capacity is over five, no, unless when conservatives hold power someday in the future.
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u/AdeptArt Apr 01 '26 edited Apr 02 '26
I remember a long time ago that there was a 22 LR bolt action SA80 which was NR. Maybe a cadet gun? I don’t know if any actually were brought in though. My memory is dodgy so if anyone knows more let me know.
edit: Yeah the L98A1 is NR, based off of the SA80. I misremembered though, it’s 5.56 and not 22. My understanding is it’s based off of an SA80 with the gas system removed.
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u/Captspaulding1 Apr 01 '26
L98A1 was still 5.56 though, and not .22. Well, the one I shot as a cadet with the RAF was at least
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u/eldaniay Apr 01 '26
I don't think that matters as long as it was designed before the stupid laws was passed
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u/AdeptArt Apr 02 '26
It definitely was. If you look up pictures it’s just like an SA80. It just doesn’t have the gas system so it’s manual action only.
I’d love to own one but it’s legit impossible to find.
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u/AdeptArt Apr 02 '26
yeah sorry my memory of this was pretty foggy. It might’ve been 5.56. Either way this is basically an SA80 without the gas system and NR
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u/alphawolf29 Apr 01 '26
Virtually any semi auto has been banned without a specific reason not to ban it
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u/waitwhatnothing Apr 01 '26
It’s been tried before. I can’t remember the businesses name but a Gunsmith in Alberta built one from surplus parts and submitted for evaluation along with a some other guns (a CETME as well I think). They had all new fire control components and modified receivers so they couldn’t accept original parts. All deemed prohib for being easily converted back to full auto despite the extensive modification.
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u/BritBuc-1 Apr 01 '26
Technically, there’s reasons why it would be banned, and a case to argue that it would be NR.
But I remember the original, so I’d definitely wait for the reviews to see if the magazine stays in the damn thing while firing it.
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u/Fine-Tie2651 Apr 01 '26
Well because the ar180b platform was banned. It would not be legal, but before that, yes it would have been considered NR unless the barrel was less than 18.5” even with C-21 because it is technically not a new design
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Apr 01 '26
[deleted]
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u/Fine-Tie2651 Apr 01 '26
No this is wrong. The design in question is not a new proprietary design and was designed before C-21 because it is an ar180b and therefore the 5 round proprietary magazine restriction doesn’t apply.
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u/kaydenb3 Apr 01 '26
There are tons of guns that used the ar18/ar180 system and were not classified as ar18/ar180 variants?
Also I didn’t mean to reply to your comment, I ment to make it my own independent comment in the thread. My bad. I didn’t mean to direct it at you specifically
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u/Fine-Tie2651 Apr 01 '26
There is a difference between the ar 18 and ar180B variants which is that the ar18 was prohibited a long time ago. All the Canadian ar180B variants were indeed ar180Bs.
On another note the CZ bren 3 would have still been allowed in Canada as it was not a new design and was simply the Cz Bren 2 with a different upper.
Therefore this design that OP has posted would likely have been NR if it hadn’t been for the the latest OIC
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u/kaydenb3 Apr 01 '26
I still don’t follow how you are figuring this is an ar180b variant? Sure all ar18 based systems were banned, but not because they all fell under category of being ar180b variants, but because they were all named individually. So today according the rules and guidelines the frt people follow it should pass. I’m not aware of other cases where just because 2 firearms use the same gas system it makes them variants of each other. It’s been my observation that it doesn’t take much at all for one gun to no longer get classified as a variant of another on the frt page.
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u/Fine-Tie2651 Apr 01 '26
Did you get your pal within the last year? Because it sure sounds like it. In the FRT or other legislation (iirc) there is often a reason for being prohibited. For example the AR-15 platform is outright banned. In the FRT, the crusader crypto is banned and it says “AR-15 variant”. The same can be said of AKs. They are banned by platform. It says so in legislation. Of course they have named individual variants but both interpretations are still there in the Firearms Act.
For your information there is a difference between an AR-18 and an AR-180B in that they are viewed in legislation as two different platforms. One being the AR-18 was a select fire platform, banned in the 90s (or 2020 not sure last I checked), and the AR-180B was the civilian version with semi auto only that was only recently banned. All of the previous AR-180B Canadian garbage guns were distinctly AR-180Bs because of their distinct lower receiver at least that was the logic (not really with this gov’t). Now I haven’t fully read the article but I am assuming that the gun in OPs post is an AR-180B because it is marketed as a civilian version. And because it is using the original lower receiver or geometry of the AR-180B, it is therefore, not a new design post C-21. If this is to come over from England via import, its FRT would be certainly prohibited as an AR-180B variant as the AR-180B platform and variants were all banned in the latest OIC.
I would suggest actually reading the legislation instead of going off hearsay from new PAL owners who think they know what they’re talking about.
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u/Benefit_Waste Apr 01 '26
Would be neither, it would be banned
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u/eldaniay Apr 01 '26
why would it be banned?
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u/Benefit_Waste Apr 01 '26
Hate to burst your bubble, but all bullpup firearms have been banned. It would follow. Even if its classed as "non-restricted and civilian market" the canadian government will think its a scary "assault" rifle
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u/Eisgeschoss Apr 01 '26
Because our current government is dogshit and way too many people keep voting Liberal.
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u/Forsaken_Edge_9184 Apr 18 '26
Don't mean to bump this but a few days ago one just got approved by motiuk manufacturing FRN: 198364, he posted on instgram: motiuk
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u/kaydenb3 Apr 01 '26
If it’s designed to take a magazine that holds more than 5 in any market, it won’t be approved. If a version was “designed” to take, say, crypto mags or some other proprietary 5-round limited mag, it would be approved. It just needs to not be banned by name in an OIC during the approval process. The gun in your link takes stanag mags so won’t be approved. At “12,000$” and built to order I don’t see why they couldn’t put some sort of dimple in the mag well, say it only takes proprietary mags, give it a different name IE “model” and boom, frt approval.
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u/eldaniay Apr 01 '26
its only banned if its designed after bill c-21 and holds more then 5
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u/kaydenb3 Apr 01 '26
Pretty sure this is (or atleast can be) a new, after c-21 design since it’s em85 and not a sa80
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u/Next-Swimming-4270 Apr 01 '26
Not gonna be able to get a Non Restricted FRT (gonna be prohibited because its semiauto). Look at the Type 97, Tavor X95/ 7, PS90; anything semiauto + mag fed + that looks tactical will be banned