r/canadaguns • u/goshathegreat • Aug 09 '25

Uhhhh guys?

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Does this mean what I think it does? New FRT for the FGC9, a 3d printed 9mm PCC.

144 Upvotes

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62

u/feeddageek Aug 10 '25 edited Aug 10 '25

If what you think is "I can print one", it probably does not mean what you think it does.

First-off C-21 made the files for the fgc9 prohibited by themselves. Second, the (new) position of the RCMP is that a PAL does not allow you to manufacture a firearm, not even for personal use.

So if you have a business firearm licence that allow you to manufacture restricted firearm, you could print a fgc9, but in any other case, you cannot! And just having or accessing the file required to print one would be a criminal offence. 

35

u/LawAbidingSparky Aug 10 '25

I distinctly remember ten years ago reading that it was legal to make a firearm for personal use. I don’t believe a law came into effect forbidding this, so why is it now illegal?

63

u/Tamination Aug 10 '25

RCMP said they changed their minds and no you can't manufacture your own firearms.

56

u/EnvironmentBright697 Aug 10 '25

It’s so annoying that the RCMP has the power to just make up their own laws as they go

28

u/SEvan12 Aug 10 '25

Tyrannical is the word your looking for, not annoying

9

u/[deleted] Aug 10 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

16

u/Kromo30 Aug 10 '25 edited Aug 10 '25

Isn’t the RCMP a step above any municipal force?

They still have jurisdiction everywhere. And and they’ll still come into your city for high level homicides and whatever, won’t they?

5

u/Schrodinger_cube Aug 10 '25

Yes, they have different roles but some officers are city police and limited in their powers but others are basically higher level units that don't do local police jobs but are specific units. Like gang units intelligence units focused on human trafficking and aoto theft. Some will be tasked to smaller non RCMP agencies as well like if a small town has a murder and needs forensic teems or crash reconstruction they are federal but support local units.. The most OP are train police if memory serves me well as they have local and Canada wide powers.

3

u/jaunfransisco Aug 10 '25

Especially when it comes to firearms law, every law enforcement agency in the country takes their cues from the RCMP. If the RCMP determines that X gun is prohib, Y part is a prohibited device, or Z action is illegal, almost certainly no municipal force is going to dispute it.

Keep in mind that criminal law- including firearm regulation- is an exclusive federal power in Canada, so there really isn't any jurisdictional disputes between the feds, provinces, and municipalities. All LEOs enforce the same laws, and where there is any doubt on what those laws might actually mean, the RCMP's opinion is decisive.

1

u/[deleted] Aug 10 '25

They don't, people are just pussies.

9

u/[deleted] Aug 10 '25

everyone gangsters until you get no knock raided

6

u/NavXIII Aug 10 '25

What if you manufactured one before they changed their mind?

3

u/Original_Dankster ON Aug 10 '25

If it's registered as a restricted, then it's legal (and restricted)

If not, then it's illegal.

1

u/outline8668 Aug 10 '25

I think the new law now prohibits possession of any unlawfully manufactured firearm. So while the firearm itself may be restricted or non-restricted, possession of it is a separate offense. I don't see anything in the wording that specifically grandfathers old homemades.

6

u/[deleted] Aug 10 '25

Ignore the others, the RCMP can't make laws

3

u/Dunhamburg Aug 10 '25

You're right. But you better have deep pockets to convince the judge.

19

u/FluffyPlays22 Aug 10 '25

"First-off C-21 made the files for the fgc9 prohibited by themselves." and "just having or accessing the file required to print one would be a criminal offence. "

Both of these are false.

The law states that it is illegal to use the files for the "purpose" of manufacturing or trafficking a firearm or prohibited device derived from that data. So just having the files themselves is totally legal, and you can use them for any purpose besides manufacturing or trafficking. If it was the case where just having the files would be illegal just having modern games installed like escape from tarkov would be in violation of that, due to the highly detailed models that can actually be used to manufacture firearms or prohibited devices.

Possession of computer data102.‍1 (1) Every person commits an offence who possesses or accesses computer data that pertain to a firearm — other than a firearm that is deemed under subsection 84(3) not to be a firearm — or a prohibited device and that are capable of being used with a 3D printer, metal milling machine or similar computer system for the purpose of manufacturing or trafficking a firearm or prohibited device derived from that computer data otherwise than under the authority of the Firearms Act or any other Act of Parliament or any regulations made under an Act of Parliament.

6

u/feeddageek Aug 10 '25

The law is poorly written and there is no consensus saying whether the qualifier "for the purpose of manufacturing or trafficking" apply to the possession (your interpretation) or to the data itself (mine).

I think that it is dangerous to choose your interpretation if you are not a well funded litigant or their lawyer. Until there is a jurisprudence I won't touch this kind of file. But hey, if someone want to hoard them thinking that they are safe because the crown will not be able to prove purpose, I'll be genuinely grateful if they create said jurisprudence and genuinely sad if they end up in prison.

1

u/FluffyPlays22 Aug 10 '25

I get that without a court case setting a precedent, there’s always some risk in how a law will actually be interpreted, that’s true for almost any law. But the way this section is written isn’t vague if you just read it in plain English. The illegal part is "possessing or accessing for the purpose of manufacturing or trafficking". That qualifier is tied to the person’s actions, not to the nature of the file itself. If it was meant to ban the files on their own, it wouldn’t need the purpose clause at all. As it’s written, you need both elements, possession and that specific purpose for it to be a crime. Otherwise, people could technically be charged for having CAD files, models, or even educational materials that just happen to be capable of making a gun, which clearly isn’t the intent.

3

u/SecureNarwhal Aug 10 '25

True North Arms 3D prints a bunch of firearms accessories and parts so they might be able to bring this to market

13

u/xpingux Aug 10 '25

The whole point of this is to print it yourself.

7

u/feeddageek Aug 10 '25

Which with the current RCMP opinion would be illegal if you are not a licensed firearm manufacturer

(it's fucked up that RCMP opinions have the force of laws, but it does until a court said it doesn't)

1

u/xpingux Aug 10 '25

These weren't made for the Canadian "market"... Or maybe they were 🤔🤔🤔

1

u/feeddageek Aug 10 '25

The RCMP says it is illegal to manufacture ANY firearm (except 84 sub 3) if you don't have the proper business license

For which market they were design has nothing to do with it

1

u/goshathegreat Aug 10 '25

No that’s not what I mean, what I mean is that these are legal here.